# Billy Hart’s roots, rise and lasting legacy are those of a master teacher and forever student: Video, Photos

- Link: https://jazzblues.eu/2023/08/31/billy-harts-roots-rise-and-lasting-legacy-are-those-of-a-master-teacher-and-forever-student-video-photos/
- Published: 2023-08-31T00:02:00+01:00
- Author: https://JazzBlues.EU

**My next two records would be for Gramavision, which had an important run of documenting
creative and interesting music in New York. When I met flutist and composer James
Newton there was some shared vision between us. **

The musicians in Newton’s circle included people like Anthony Davis, Abdul Wadud,
and Pheeroan akLaff. In that world there was a real dedication to finding a bridge
to contemporary European Classical music, and I appreciated that perspective: For
example, their bassist, Rick Rozie, was in the Hartford symphony. A lot of their
first records were on India Navigation, which was a well-meaning but bare bones 
affair owned by a lawyer who helped musicians, Bob Cummins, before several artists
on that roster sort of moved over to Gramavision, owned by Jonathan F. P. Rose, 
whose family was important in NYC real estate. (Fredrick P. Rose Hall at Jazz at
Lincoln Center is named for Jonathan’s father.)  I’m on Newton’s Gramavision LPs
_Daydream_ (1983) and _Luella_ (1984), which led into my releases _Oshumare_ (1985)
and _Rah_ (1988).

Some people really like_ Oshumare_. Billy Drummond told me he thought it was one
of the best records of the whole era; Ethan really loves it too. Dave Holland is
on both _Enchance _and _Oshumare_, and even Dave asked me, “How did you like this
one, man? This was a lot better, right?” — but I didn’t agree with him, especially
now. _Oshumare_ felt almost a little commercial after _Enchance_. Of course, the
music and the style was my choice, but, looking back, I appreciate the first blast
of avant-garde more than the comparatively conservative follow-up. But, like _Enchance_,
the musicians on_ Oshumare_ are a group of people not usually associated with each
other, and they certainly all do play very well!

Mark Gray is an excellent studio musician in addition to being a talented jazz pianist.
I met Mark on a Hubert Laws date, and he became part of the social system I had 
with my first wife Dolores, Hannibal Peterson, Carvin, Lott, and so forth. Mark 
contributed to_ Enchance_, but is more visible on _Oshumare_, taking a synthesizer
solo on the opening “Duchess.” For a time, Mark was the one to help me put my songs
in proper order, and on_ Oshumare _they are “Duchess” and “Lorca.” Going forward,
many of my compositions would reflect my family. “Duchess” is for the grandmother
who bought me my first drum, and “Lorca” is for my son, who is now a well-respected
drummer living in California.

James Newton had hired Kenny Kirkland for a gig and I was impressed right away. 
I then checked out the ECM records Kenny made with Miroslav Vitous and thought that
was the way he was playing: Romantic and multi-directional. The Kirkland legend 
has grown over the years, and at this point we all know he was one of the true greats
of his era. However, when I called him for _Oshumare_, in my mind Kenny was mainly
a romantic player, I hadn’t heard him with Jeff Watts yet. The waltz he contributed
to the date, “Chance,” is really beautiful.

Mark played keyboards and Kenny played piano, but there are also two guitarists 
on the album, Bill Frisell and Kevin Eubanks. I had a dream with two guitarists 
playing together: it sounded like a harp, and I knew that John Coltrane suggested
that Alice Coltrane start playing a harp. Upon awakening, I thought I should get
two guitarists for my next album. When the Gramavision opportunity arose, I started
asking around, and bassist Marc Johnson told me one of the guitarists needed to 
be Bill Frisell. I asked Marc what Frisell sounded like. Marc frowned, thought about
it, and replied, “I can’t tell you.”

That was good enough for me, so I called Bill for the date, and his piece “Waiting
Inside” was strong and evocative. Dave Holland recommended Kevin Eubanks, who also
came from a serious musical family.

I had heard Branford Marsalis with Art Blakey, and had also played a week in Ron
Carter’s band with Wynton, Branford, and myself. (The repertoire for that piano-
less quartet ended up on Ron’s album _Etudes_ with Art Farmer, Bill Evans, and Tony
Williams.) At that time, Branford reminded me of Wayne Shorter a bit, like his fine
solo on Dave Holland’s fast jazz tune “Cosmosis.”

Steve Coleman was obviously already on his own path, although Steve got a lot of
direction from the important drummer/composer Doug Hammond. When I saw a performance
of Doug’s band with bass, cello, and Steve, I really liked Steve’s conception. In
recent years Steve and I have been more in touch, for Steve is a perpetual student,
just like myself.

Kenny Kirkland, Bill Frisell, Kevin Eubanks, Branford Marsalis, Steve Coleman: These
are all important and influential names now — in particular, Steve’s original concepts
dominate the creative scene — but at the time they were all simply young cats that
I thought had potential.

Violinist Didier Lockwood was a last-minute addition. Just a few days before my 
date, I participated in Didier’s Gramavision recording _Out of the Blue _with Gordon
Beck and Cecil McBee. Probably thanks to my grandmother Viola, I always kept up 
with an interest in romantic European classical music, and I loved the sound of 
Didier right away. He brought something special to _Oshumare_ — try what he plays
on “Lorca” — and I was so pleased with the addition of violin that I would feature
Mark Feldman in my first working band a few years later. Manolo Badrena played hand
drums on a few tracks, giving this date a truly contemporary flavor.

Overall,_ Oshumare_ was a relaxed session, and features a mysterious painting from
Ornette Coleman’s collection on the cover.

The follow-up,_ Rah_, is a memorial for my brother Ronald Alfred Hart, who died 
suddenly of a heart attack in Hawaii after a basketball game. (_Rah _is R.A.H., 
his initials.) Three pieces on this LP were specifically composed for Ronald. “Motional”
is for the way he moved in sports (he was a beloved coach for football and basketball,
and worked at Howard University and other places), “Renada” is the combination of
his two daughters, Ronda and Renee, and “Naaj” means “sun” in Wolof.

“Ra” (like “Rah”) can mean sun as well, and I had meant for the cover to the LP 
to be a sun, but John Blake beat me to a sun-themed cover for Gramavison, so we 
went with a picture of a cymbal that still looks a bit like a sun.

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Some of the musical circumstances surrounding the recording of _Rah_ were a bit 
rushed. It was supposed to be Kenny Garrett and Branford Marsalis, but Garrett went
with Miles Davis and Branford never showed for the rehearsals. In a panic I called
Dave Liebman for heat (more on Dave below) and Ralph Moore for lyricism. Eddie Henderson
returned on trumpet, sounding great as always, and Dave’s wife, Caris Visentin, 
thickened the texture with oboe on Liebman’s song “Junque.”

One of the highlights is Kenny Kirkland’s wonderful, ferocious solo on “Naaj.”  
At that time, my four favorite bass players were Buster Williams, Dave Holland, 
Cecil McBee, and Eddie Gomez, and _Rah_ has a couple of Eddie’s Spanish-influenced,
romantic, lyrical bass solos.

Bill Frisell and Kevin Eubanks were back again from _Oshumare_. It worked, but neither
album really features the two guitars playing together like a giant harp the way
I first dreamed it. Still, the two Gramavision LPs are a nice snapshot of the times,
and they both came from that dream of two guitars.

_Enchance_, _Oshumare_, and _Rah_ are all strictly studio dates. The first band 
of mine that played gigs was _Such Great Friends_ (1983) with Billy Harper, Stanley
Cowell, and Reggie Workman, which evolved to _Great Friends_ (1986) with the addition
of Sonny Fortune. When a Japanese promoter asked me to put a band together, I suggested
some of my favorite musicians who were already familiar with Japan. I never intended
to formally lead that group, it was a collective.

Reggie was a bit older, he had worked with John Coltrane and Art Blakey, and went
on to be active in all sorts of fields, including being a pillar of jazz education
at the New School. Stanley Cowell knew the whole history and played it his own way.
Billy Harper was coming out of Coltrane, a lot of power and commitment to the gospel
ethos, a true Texas tenor. Sonny Fortune was similar, an incandescent force but 
on alto.

For Harper and Fortune, Coltrane was like a religion, and that was OK with me, for
Coltrane was my religion, too. Harper was more quiet, but Fortune loved to talk 
about music. When Sonny Fortune called me on the phone, if one of us mentioned John’s
name, that was it, we would discuss John for two or three hours.

It’s not easy to be in a collective. In the end certain people take charge, and 
that’s probably right, for usually those people are doing all the administrative
work. I enjoyed both versions of Great Friends, but not every internal interaction
was smooth sailing. Those two Great Friends records also have lesser production 
values; certainly the albums solely under my own name sound much better.

The next two records were for Arabesque and continued somewhat in the same vein 
as the Gramavision albums. The head of Gramavision, Jonathan F. P. Rose, told me
he liked me, but that he couldn’t support more releases unless I took a band out
on tour. When Daniel Chriss asked me to record for Arabeske, I looked for musicians
that might actually be able to go on the road. The same basic line-up is on both
_Amethyst _and _Oceans of Time_, and together they may be my most forceful statement
as a leader, where I was calling all the shots and writing a lot of music. As with
all my albums up to this point, it was a diverse cast of people who may have never
played together otherwise.

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_(Santi Debriano, David Kikoski, John Stubblefield, Billy Hart, David Fiuczynski,
Mark Copland, Mark Feldman)_

John Stubblefield was a soulful tenor player but also a proficient arranger and 
composer. He was from Arkansas, and his heart was in the blues. Stubblefield was
also a member of the AACM, at least for a time, and I was attached to the idea of
someone like that in my band. At the opposite end of the spectrum, Mark Feldman 
was a rhapsodic violinist who loved European classical music. On Stubblefield’s 
tune “King of Harts” first Stubblefield plays, then Feldman plays. They couldn’t
be more different, but they both fit my music.

Having all this guitar and piano on these Gramavision and Arabesque records gives
them a somewhat symphonic atmosphere. David Fiuczynski is well known for his rock
group, the Screaming Headless Torsos, but I saw Fiuczynski in Ben Perowsky’s band
where he impressed me with his improvising. Fiuczynski sounded enough like my dream
of two guitarists for me to call him cold. On his fiery “Melanos,” Fuze pulls out
all the stops.

Dave Kikoski is a more obvious choice, his talent speaks for itself, and at that
point he had been playing with Roy Haynes for several years. I met Kikoski on a 
nice Ralph Moore record date with Buster Williams, _623 C Street_. Kikoski impressed
with his facility, he had that kind of McCoy to Herbie to Chick thing we all like,
but he did it in his own way. Try Kikoski’s “Shadows” for Dave in a more reflective
mood.

Santi Debriano is from Panama and has a lyrical and modern conception. Santi takes
a really beautiful solo on “Amethyst.” Marc Copland guests on synthesizer on two
tunes; Marc and I had been playing trio with Gary Peacock.

For the second Arabesque date,_ Oceans of Time_, Chris Potter was a guest artist
because Chris had subbed for Stubblefield on a few gigs. Chris was already a star
at a very young age. I liked the two tenors in the front line, and afterwards tried
to continue that when I could. Craig Handy filled in for Stubblefield at the reunion
gig in Healdsburg.

The name of the title track, “Oceans of Time,” is from a line in _Bram Stoker’s 
Dracula_, where Gary Oldman says, “I have crossed oceans of time to find you.” Women
can’t resist the archetype of Dracula, and men can’t resist the archetype of Carmen(
from the Bizet opera). In the end, I _am _a romantic!

Apart from the meaning in the movie, I like “Oceans of Time” as a phrase, suggesting
all kinds of music and rhythm, which is also why it became the title of this memoir.

Musically, my song “Oceans of Time” is based on certain family whistles that my 
parents used when calling Ronald and me in for dinner. My father’s whistle was fast
and short, while my mother’s was more bluesy. We’d be playing down the hill with
a bunch of other little kids…but when we heard those whistles, we knew it was time
to go in and wash up.

This group played in New York and toured Japan. I always meant to get back to the
Oceans of Time band, it really seemed to be the most like me of all the bands I 
led. But the phone always kept ringing for any group but my own.

By this point, I was well into long-term associations with Dave Liebman and Richie
Beirach. These two really go together, they have fed off of each other musically
for over 50 years now. Their original Quest group was with George Mraz and Al Foster,
but when Al left to play with Miles Davis they got me, and when George went with
Tommy Flanagan they got Ron McClure.

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_(Quest: Richie Beirach, Billy Hart, David Liebman, Ron McClure)_

In the final analysis, Quest is really Liebman and Beirach’s band, but they bill
it as a collective, and we all play like we are leaders. In some ways Quest was 
the most comfortable I felt since the Mwandishi sextet, at least in terms of a band
that gave me a chance to develop my drum language on the gigs in real time.

Liebman had played with Miles Davis and Elvin Jones, and was coming out of that 
post-Coltrane thing. (Liebman and I are on Miles’s _On the Corner_ together.) Beirach
was too, but he also was really committed to modernism in the European manner. At
the time, I felt the lineage was: McCoy, Herbie, Chick…then Richie. Richie taught
both Kenny Kirkland and Joey Calderazzo a lot, and, in fact, one time when I heard
Kirkland on the radio, I thought it was Beirach.

Ron McClure had a lot of experience, he had played with Wynton Kelly, but he also
was ready to experiment. McClure’s flexibility is his greatest feature, the music
can change direction thanks to Ron’s guidance. A lot of Liebman’s music is on a 
pedal point, and Ron can mix it up.

All three — Liebman, Beirach, McClure — are significant composers.

At our best, Quest almost pulled off a coup, both musically and in the music business,
as _the_ next important acoustic jazz sound. Our first studio document, _Quest II_
from 1986, has something delicate and multi-directional next to burning jazz pieces
and the occasional driving even-eighth beat. Ethan says he can hear my totally mature
drum concept come together on _Quest II_, and maybe Ethan’s right. For about five
or six years Quest was very busy, especially in Europe.

Internally, there was a certain amount of discussion about how we were being passed
over by the American jazz critics in favor of David Murray and the Marsalises. Whether
that was true or not, Quest lost momentum and went on hiatus for many years in the‘
90s; during that time I played more with Dave or Richie separately than together.
Dave put together several more projects that had high-level tours; the fact that
bright lights Michael Brecker and Joe Lovano agreed to work for Dave on the Three
Tenors indicates the level of respect Brecker and Lovano had for Liebman. In fact,
Brecker told me directly, “I’m here to study with Lieb.” In time Quest reunited,
and we’ve occasionally played together again since 2005.

I first heard about Ethan Iverson from trombonist Christoph Schweitzer, who told
me, “There’s this young pianist who can sight-read _anything_.” I ended up making
one of Ethan’s first albums, _The Minor Passions_ from 1998, with Reid Anderson 
on bass. I was comfortable in that music, especially with Reid, who I thought was
a great bassist. Over the years several notable people like Nasheet Waits and Rodney
Green checked out _The Minor Passions_ and reported positively on my performance.
Apparently even then, Ethan was trying to showcase my conception at the drums.

It was a surprise to everybody when Ethan, Reid, and a drummer who had stayed in
Minneapolis, Dave King, broke through and had commercial success with The Bad Plus.
I didn’t admire their overwhelming emphasis on binary thought, and teased Ethan,“
It seems like you are putting more Elvis Presley in your music now.”

The Bad Plus was such a hit that Ethan managed to get his own week at the Village
Vanguard in a quartet with Mark Turner and Ben Street. Ethan knew Mark and Ben from
their work with Kurt Rosenwinkel, who was a leader of contemporary thought for Ethan’s
generation. The week at the Vanguard was nice, I enjoyed everyone’s playing. In 
fact, I enjoyed it so much, I called_ them _for my next gig two weeks later in February
2004, a little performance in a town I had just moved to, Montclair, New Jersey.
Mark, Ethan, and Ben played a bunch of my tunes and the gig went well.

Ethan met with me soon after and said, “Billy, the quartet was good at the Vanguard…
but when you were the leader, where we played your tunes and you addressed the audience,
it was much better. You are the best musician in the band. If you want this to be
your quartet, let’s do it.”

In recent decades this has happened with some frequency. Someone will make me the
nominal leader and we will do a record and a tour. It’s always fun to get the kudos
without doing much of the administrative work, and usually the other musicians are
good enough that it’s satisfactory for all concerned.

At first I thought this was what Ethan was proposing, so I said yes. In time, the
quartet has proven to be the most durable and longest-running ensemble I’ve ever
been with. We haven’t gigged _quite_ as much as I would’ve liked, but there’s been
at least one or two tours a year and consistent local runs at the Vanguard, the 
Jazz Standard, Birdland, Dizzy’s and other good NYC venues. There was one album 
for High Note, and two so far for ECM; a third ECM album will be released next year.

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With the quartet, I was able to return to the avant-garde style of _Enchance_, the
multi-directional line. Liebman had something to do with that, too, for Lieb had
hired me for a recording of Coltrane’s _Meditations_ suite, and I found a few new
things to play that I really liked. Already with Richie in Quest, there was a more
lyrical approach to multi-directional music than the full-on fire of the post-_Ascension_
churn, and the pianist in Liebman’s _Meditations_ group, Phil Markowitz, kept that
going with a big assist from the great Cecil McBee.

I can see Beirach, Markowitz, Mark Gray, Kirkland, Kikoski, and Copland as all connected
to each other harmonically. Ethan is different, and has a totally unique way of 
harmonizing my melodies, somewhere between Thelonious Monk and a Hollywood film 
score. Ethan helped me put together my most epic multi-directional composition, “
Song for Balkis,” which opens our album _All Our Reasons_ in a 13-minute performance.

Musically, Mark Turner is really the quartet’s ace in the hole. Everyone knows that
he is one of the finest — if not _the_ finest — tenor saxophonists of his generation,
yet somehow he keeps coming back to play in the quartet. He’s incredibly influential,
I can’t tell you how many young tenor players I’ve heard imitate Mark Turner. Mark
is a genius and an innovator.  We’ve had the very highest level subs for Mark: Josh
Redman, Chris Potter, and Dayna Stephens. Josh and Chris are stars: they can tell
a story and put the audience on the same page in a way that is undeniable. Dayna
is more like Mark, a bit mysterious and elliptical, committed to the search. But
it will always be Mark’s gig if he wants to keep doing it.

Some of what makes Mark Turner unique is his interest in Lennie Tristano, Lee Konitz,
and Warne Marsh. I played with Lee quite a bit in the ‘70s but never paid much attention
to the Tristano school otherwise, although Liebman studied with Tristano and both
Wayne Shorter and Herbie Hancock credit that school as an influence. I did notice
that when Mark Turner started playing in my band, Lee Konitz was suddenly at all
my gigs to see Mark. I really love Mark’s 5/4 tribute to Tristano, “Lennie-Groove,”
just like everyone else. So many people have played “Lennie-Groove” that it’s almost
like “Giant Steps” for that generation of musicians.

Ben Street really believes in the tradition. I do too, but I may have met my match
with Ben Street. We both search for logical solutions to the most “out” music:  
that there is always a way to make the avant-garde presentable. He also worked with
the modern historian of the clave, Danilo Perez. I can play_ anything_ with Ben 
and he will hear it and make it work.

With Ben I noticed how he loved Jimmy Garrison. Garrison’s work with John Coltrane
remains underrated. My peers didn’t always keep Garrison’s contribution in the forefront:
Indeed, the bassists in this chapter so far, Dave Holland, Buster Williams, Eddie
Gomez, Cecil McBee, Ron McClure, and Santi Debriano, are not so much in the Garrison
line, except perhaps for Buster, who shares that gritty Philadelphia lineage. (Jymie
Merritt was one of those Philly bassists: One time Lee Morgan turned around to look
accusingly at Merritt, who had gone fully into a moment of breaking up the time 
with unexpected double-stops. Merriit responded to Morgan’s glare by yelling, “It’s
too late, Lee!” as he stayed inside his abstract bass patterns.)

The younger generations have done something to bring back Garrison into the music:
I was impressed when one of the biggest bass stars of his era, Larry Grenadier, 
told me that he was trying to get to Garrison. The bassists that have subbed for
Ben in the quartet, Thomas Morgan, Joe Martin, and Joe Sanders, all know their Garrison
as well.

At first I was taken aback by the sparse approach employed by everyone in the quartet.
Mark’s solos would begin slowly, Ethan would lay out, Ben’s low thumps could make
Garrison sound busy in comparison. I was used to my peers, like Quest, the Oceans
of Time band, or the music on Great Friends, where we fervently played thousands
and thousands of notes in the post-Coltrane tradition. But since the quartet was
so sparse, the texture allowed my drumming to speak clearly. For the first time,
I also started setting up many of the pieces with unaccompanied drum solos. Ethan
insisted on including many blues pieces, to the point where I’ve been surprised 
at how much of a blues band the quartet has become. Mark, Ben, and Ethan have all
expressed appreciation at how playing in my band gives them a chance to learn about
the tradition.

If the quartet features my softer and bluesier side, then The Cookers is where the
modal fury remains. That’s almost the reason for that band, to keep the passion 
from an earlier era alive. David Weiss is like Ethan, he organizes the band and 
books the tours. Internally it is fairly collective, with everyone contributing 
compositions and telling stories. The names of the musicians in the Cookers are 
a roll call of the best: Billy Harper, Eddie Henderson, Donald Harrison, George 
Cables, and Cecil McBee. (Craig Handy and Azar Lawrence also have played in the 
Cookers on record.) I look up to them all as mentors and teachers.

In 2016, my old friend Jessica Felix honored me at her Healdsburg festival in California.“
40 Years of Billy Hart” included the_ Enchance_ repertoire in a group with Eddie
Henderson, Oliver Lake, Joshua Redman, Craig Taborn, and Dave Holland, the Oceans
of Time repertoire with Craig Handy, Chris Potter, Mark Feldman, Dave Fiuczynski
and Cecil McBee, plus the standard line ups of Quest and the Quartet. It was just
fabulous of Jessica to give me that opportunity.

My discography covers a lot of terrain, but one area that has not been documented
is the percussion ensemble. In the ‘70s, Horacee Arnold put Colloquium III together
with Freddie Waits and myself. We did a few workshops and gigs but never recorded.
Milford Graves put together an epic Harlem performance of multi-directional drummers
that included Rashied Ali, Beaver Harris, Ed Blackwell, Andrew Cyrille, and myself.

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_(Colloquium III: Billy Hart, Horacee Arnold, and Freddie Waits)_

More recently Andrew Cyrille and I have played duo and trio with guest saxophonists
including Dave Liebman, Joe Lovano, David Ware and Gary Bartz. Together Andrew and
I performed at the memorial for Paul Motian. In each case, I love rehearsing and
performing with other drummers in a context where the spotlight is truly on the 
drums.

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